Fiber print washing -- emulsion flecks at edges

[Doremus Scudder]

Philip,

I'm going to disagree with Drew above on a point or two. First, a wash aid is always beneficial with fiber-base papers and will shorten wash time (which is what you are after) and ensure a better wash.

Generally speaking, fixer is fixer, and the active ingredient in TF-5 is ammonium thiosulfate, just like all other rapid fixers. Yes, there are advantages to the alkaline pH; faster wash times generally and better storage lifespan, but much depends on how you use your fixer.

As far as one-bath versus two-bath regimes go, it all depends on your desired level of permanence and convenience versus economy. A one-bath regime works just fine, but the fixer capacity is smaller. Ron Mowrey (aka Photo Engineer) used a one-bath regime, as does Drew, apparently. With your low throughput, you may want to consider it too. Just be aware, that if you want to fix to "optimum-permanence" standards, capacity will be around 10 8x10-inch prints per liter. You can get up to 40 if you settle for a lower level of permanence. With a two-bath regime, the capacity is effectively doubled, but you need the extra tray or a separate fixing/toning session. A two-bath fixing regime also helps ensure good fixing; since the second bath stays relatively fresh, by-products don't build up there, enabling the fixing process to go to completion. The danger with single-bath regimes is that it's easy to overuse the fixer if you're not keeping good track of throughput.

You may want to look for a Paterson 12x16 print washer. These are around both new and used. I have two, which I've modified a bit, but they work fine once you get the agitation plunger operating well (they can be finicky). I don't think one of these would break the bank.

So, some practical suggestions for your problem:

1. Just continue as you are now and trim your borders. If the flaking an the edges isn't an issue for mounted display prints, then maybe this is the easiest.

2. Try to limit wet time by one of the following methods:
A. Just streamline what you are already doing by getting prints to the wash more quickly and by keeping wash time to the minimum necessary for adequate washing.
B. Adopt Ilford's "Optimum-permanence Sequence," where you use stronger fixer, one-bath, for a very short time followed by a five-minute water rinse, 10 minutes in wash aid and then a final wash of up to 20 minutes if you tone. Check out the Ilford website here: https://www.ilfordphoto.com/ilford-o...nce-fb-papers/
C. Divide your workflow into printing and toning sessions like I do. Develop, stop and a slightly-extended fix one followed by a 30-minute wash and then dry. comprise the printing session. Collect prints till you have enough for a toning session (I like to be able to fill my print washer a couple of times, so 24 prints is the minimum for me). Water soak, fix 2, toner, rinse (in a running-water tray), wash-aid and then a final 30-minute wash and dry makes up the toning session. This way, you're dividing wet time into two parts, drying the prints between, which prevents a lot of emulsion swelling. Plus, you're able to print in small batches and then live with prints for a while before deciding which are keepers and worthy of toning.

A note about Ilford's optimum-permanence sequence. The rinse between fix and wash aid and the longer treatment in wash aid are essential parts of the process. Without those, there is a risk of underwashing. You've got the testing down, so testing washing should be easy.

Hope this helps somewhat,

Doremus

[Ulophot]

I am truly grateful always for the helpful and experienced advice I get here.

As stated above, I have no way to cool the running water in the summer; I can only use a still bath and add chilled water. I have no place for trays outside the sink.

Doremus, I do use your single-fix session and 2nd fix/toning session sometimes, but it doesn't always work out with what I have to do, so I go through first fix, clean up the other trays, and set up fix 2, toner, and a weak post-toner HCA as a rinse. After that, pre-wash, HCA, final wash.

My washing sequence is quite close to the Ilford optimum, by design. The main problem appears to be temp and then water-sitting time, which is not so long for final prints as for the first prints of the session. I rarely print more than four or five finals, so the last would be out of fix 1 not more than 15 minutes, usually, after the first. Of course, if I have bleaching to do, that's another matter, though I just watched a video on a different approach to that, which I may get around to trying (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a-UjdSfclx4).

Fortunately, the weather is cooling down a bit here. I have a small exhibit to start printing in a couple of weeks.

[Drew Wiley]

Back to my own method : I do a limited number of prints per session, typically 6 @ 16X20 inch keepers, plus test strips and one or two non-keepers. A liter of 1:3 one-shot usage TF4 is ample for this purpose. No need for a second stop bath. Yes, the fixer cost is somewhat higher doing it this way, and throwing it out at the end of each daily session; but time is valuable too. I live in a coastal area with enough moisture that I don't need to do any outside plant or lawn watering, so don't feel guilty about standardizing on one hour wash times. My slot washers are my own design and quite conservative in their water usage, and more effective in certain other ways than commercial designs. But you can go with simple trays if you change the water enough times. An old Kodak tray siphon might help with the initial part of that; but it's mainly a matter of the hypo diffusing out through soaking.

In terms of bleaching, I just use Farmers Reducer, and then a brief refresher of fixer afterwards, then into the washer. Since Kodak stopped making Farmer's, I now buy it from Photog Formulary. You prepare A & B liquid solutions in advance, but only mix together enough A&B for a brief period. Their instructions lead to an awfully strong formula, so you'll need to dilute it considerably more than they suggest if you want subtle control. I place the print, still wet from a holding water tray, on the semi-vertical glass squeegee board at the end of the sink, then squeegee off the suplus water. Then, with a brush in one hand and a running little hose in the other, I keep a little stream running right below the area I'm bleaching, so that none of the rest of the image gets affected. I can't image doing this with the print lying flat.

[Ulophot]

Thanks, Drew.

I've been obliged by exceptionally rising water rates to economize on water where possible, so I do use multiple changes of water rather than relying on high flow rates. Since I have only trays (my wash tub is, effectively, a tray), it means a lot of standing there shuffling prints. As Doremus pointed out to someone here a couple of years ago, the fixer needs somewhere (fresh water) into which to diffuse; a stack of prints in a still bath doesn't necessarily offer that.

Perhaps you watched the bleaching video I linked. I have been using the method you describe, but as master-bleacher Bruce Barnbaum notes, one needs to periodically check progress by putting the print back in the fix again. What interested me about Matthew's method in the video is the full "rinse" (several changes of water) and the highly dilute solution on a squeegeed horizontal print, which, he said, bleaches slowly enough that there is no change to even bleached delicate highlights in a final fix after all bleaching is done. And he has not experienced staining, either.

[Doremus Scudder]

... so I go through first fix, clean up the other trays, and set up fix 2, toner, and a weak post-toner HCA as a rinse. After that, pre-wash, HCA, final wash. ...

Philip,

You can probably eliminate the weak HCA rinse before the pre-wash if you want to save some time (and maybe water). The main thing with a pre-wash before the HCA treatment in the Ilford regime is to get the surface fixer and some of the fix in the emulsion out, the long HCA treatment both bonds with the remaining fixer in the paper and prepares the emulsion for more efficient washing, which then happens in the final wash. Your weak HCA rinse isn't hurting anything, but is not really needed.

Doremus

[Doremus Scudder]

... In terms of bleaching, I just use Farmers Reducer, and then a brief refresher of fixer afterwards, then into the washer. Since Kodak stopped making Farmer's, I now buy it from Photog Formulary. You prepare A & B liquid solutions in advance, but only mix together enough A&B for a brief period. Their instructions lead to an awfully strong formula, so you'll need to dilute it considerably more than they suggest if you want subtle control. I place the print, still wet from a holding water tray, on the semi-vertical glass squeegee board at the end of the sink, then squeegee off the surplus water. Then, with a brush in one hand and a running little hose in the other, I keep a little stream running right below the area I'm bleaching, so that none of the rest of the image gets affected. I can't image doing this with the print lying flat.

I do exactly this, but use a rehalogenating bleach of potassium ferricyanide and potassium bromide. I have stock solutions of both on hand and mix just what I need before use. The advantage of the rehalogenating bleach is that it is somewhat reversible. If I go a bit too far, a dip back into the print developer often saves the day.

I do find that extensive bleaching can cause the print to split-tone, so try to avoid that and tone lightly prints that have been bleached. I wonder if Farmer's Reducer has that problem, Drew?

Best,

Doremus

[Ulophot]

Well, a will and a way. Until I can set up something better, at least this gets my prints out of the water sooner and lets me keep printing.

Doremus, with a half-hour wash after Fix 1, do you then rinse your drying screens? I try to be scrupulous about contamination. I have sponging my screens with a 10% bleach solution and then rinse, every 4-6 months, depending on how much printing I do. But that's with full washing.



(My enlarger is out of frame to the left of the paper cutter.)

[Pieter]

Well, a will and a way. Until I can set up something better, at least this gets my prints out of the water sooner and lets me keep printing.

Doremus, with a half-hour wash after Fix 1, do you then rinse your drying screens? I try to be scrupulous about contamination. I have sponging my screens with a 10% bleach solution and then rinse, every 4-6 months, depending on how much printing I do. But that's with full washing.



(My enlarger is out of frame to the left of the paper cutter.)

I would think that if the prints are thoroughly washed, there would not be any residual fixer to be deposited on your drying screens. If there is, your prints have not been completely washed.

[Doremus Scudder]

Philip,

Pieter beat me to it. Prints should be thoroughly washed after fix one. Thirty minutes is a minimum, I use longer most of the time. You're trying to reduce wet time, so at least the minimum. That should prevent contamination of your screens.

Best,

Doremus