Photo tray stains

[Bill Kumpf]

I just purchased several used photo trays. Most appear to be almost new. Two of the trays have some chemical stains. The seller did not know what the stains were. All in all, it was too good of a deal to pass up.

All the trays are scheduled for a good soap and hot water scrubbing. Is there any way to remove the stains? Or does it really matter?

Thanks for your comments.

[domenico Foschi]

The stained trays are probably due to developer.
I have read somewhere that developer stained trays can be cleaned with ferry.
I scrub all of them frequently with water and dish soap, sometime with regular bleach.
Make sure to scrub the bottom as well, since when you stack them there is the danger of some contamination: better be safe than sorry.
The most important though are the developer trays: a contaminated one will ruin your prints, stop bath and fixer trays pose less than a problem, but still is important to clean them and give to individual ones a specific job.

[Andrey Donchev]

You can find a recipe for stain remover for trays in the Anchell's "The Darkroom Cookbook". If you don't have a copy of the book, I can write it here.

[jnantz]

bill

i have never used this on trays
but i have read that mr clean's magic erasers
work well.

YMMV

john

[Bill Kumpf]

Andrey,

I do have Anchell's "The Darkroom Cookbook". I will check for the formulas.

Thanks all for the leads

[Aled Hughes]

Milton baby fluid is cheep and readily available, mix as they recomend and leave overnight, works a treat.

[Louie Powell]

In my experience, a tray used for developer tends to acquire a pretty intense stain over time. I've managed to clean mine using ordinary hypochlorite bleach, but the next time I use them, the stain comes back the instant that the developer is poured in.

Also, it's been my experience that the stain is only noticeable when the trays are dry and in storage. So if you use them more than you store them, you won't notice the stain.

[SamReeves]

Darkroom trays will always have a stain or two no matter what you do to them. That's why they stay in the darkroom and not on the dining room table! ;)

[Ralph Barker]

Plus, if you have large trays, be sure not to use them for making other "mountain beverages". ;)

[Andrey Donchev]

It is formula #199.

[Jim Galli]

Like removing the salt from a Bonneville car :eek:

[Gary L. Quay]

I have rinsed and wiped each tray after each use, and leaned them against my sink with air space between them to complete the drying process, and after 3 years they're all still almost spotless. The tray I use for selenium toning has a few spots near the rim. I can't promise that this will work for 20 years, but so far, so good.

--Gary

[Toyon]

Photofinish works quite well, though slightly abrasive (they also make a non-abrasive version).

[Jim Jones]

If bleach is used on trays into which chemicals have been absorbed, a nasty smell can be emitted. I don't know if it's harmful, but wouldn't want to find out the hard way. Also, using abrasive cleaners might hasten future absorption of chemicals. If one marks the trays so they are always used for the same chemicals, contamination is no problem. Stained trays do no harm. They might even look like modern art, framed and hung on a wall, after one goes digital.

[Gene McCluney]

The stains should have absolutely no affect on their use for photo developing, as long as they are clean of previous dried, or caked chemicals. The stains just won't matter. In fact if all of your trays are stain free, then you aren't doing much darkroom work. I wonder how many of you have actually toured a high-volume hand processed print lab?? If it has been in business for years, there will be stains.

[Alan Davenport]

It is possible to keep new trays from getting stained, but once a tray has stains they're mostly permanent. The stains are harmless.

[Andrew O'Neill]

CLR

I use it on my coffee pot for a sparkling shine and on my developing trays to get them "sort of clean"...those white eraser sponges work really well with just water too.

[Bill Kumpf]

Thanks for all the information.

I rummaged through the cabinets and found some toilet bowl cleaner. In about 10 minutes the stain was gone. I neutralized the chlorine with vinegar. The trays look good. I will see how long it takes to re appear. Just don’t tell my wife I know how to use toilet bowl cleaner…………

[blevblev]

My question is, if you use bleach or toilet bowl cleaner to clean the trays, then won't those chemicals get impregnated in the trays just like the developer did? And if they do, what effect might they have on the development process? Why bother? The stains do no harm, so it sounds to me like there are some folks who are being a little obbssesive compulsive about this.

During World War II, the Germans used to booby-trap picture frames while they were retreating before the Allied advance. They would go into some bombed out house, make a picture frame crooked, and attach a bomb with some kind of trigger that would go off when moved. The idea is that when some obssesive person tried to straighten it out....KaBoom!

Don't let your development trays explode on you!

[Ken Lee]

What if you use the same tray to hold a different chemical each time ?

I do that with my Sterilite "trays (http://www.kenleegallery.com/html/tech/devtray.htm)", and they have no stains at all.

[John Kasaian]

I got some neat yellow Kodak trays on ebay soke time ago. Two of them were badly stained. Toilet bowl cleaner got them pretty well cleaned up and they haven't exploded yet! ;)

[jeroldharter]

This does not help with existing stains but:

I use the single tray method for processing prints. Fewer trays and no stains, even from selenium toning.

The stains probably won't hurt anything. I always figure that the time and nuisance of trying to clean a used tray is not worth it (although that does not seem to stop me from buying them).

[jimmygcreative]

a tech from a well known lab in LA turned me on to using house bleach! it works! use with water and let soak over night

[John Cahill]

I worked with old lab rats in the early 1960s. At the end of the day, they always dumped the developer, then poured the stop bath into the empty developer tray and sloshed it around a bit before dumping it and leaving for the day. FWIW.

[Maris Rusis]

I like stained trays.

To avoid cross-contamination I always use the same tray for developing, the fixer tray is always the fixer tray , and so on. Even though I wash and dry trays after a darkroom session stains accumulate. Each chemical leaves its characteristic stain so I just look at the trays to see which is for what.

Maybe a stain can be beautiful? After some decades my developer tray has formed a gleaming dark grey metallic sheen that celebrates the billions of silver atoms that have sojourned there.

[Jim MacKenzie]

Developer stain won't harm your prints. Just be sure to use the tray consistently for developer.

[Ron McElroy]

I have a couple of old 16x20 trays that became heavily stained from selenium toner. I thought it looked cool until it started staining the backs of the paper. I just scrubbed them with white scotch brite and hot water. They are still stained, but don't stain my paper.

[Jack Fisher]

50 years ago as a darkroom rat, I used a little Potassium Permanganate to clean developer trays. Just a very small amount of the crystals (a ml or so) in the tray using water to dissolve will absorb the stains. Caution: it will turn skin brown, so handle with care and/or rubber gloves, rinse well and drain.

I still have about an ounce of the stuff, and use it occasionally. I understand it is used in quantity in some water softening processes to remove iron. So, it may be available in such supply houses. Enough to fill a 35mm film can could last years.

Jack

[otzi]

Form an other Forum.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Tetenal markets a product here in Europe called EXARGENT, a 5 - 10% Thiourea and 1 - 5 % Sulfamic Acid solution. I used it on some silver deposits (metallic by the looks of it) left behind in a Ilford CAP-40 processor and it was very effective. What would be your recommendation on something like this? Seems to be less of a hazard than the dichromate. -- Jim
+++++++++
Ephraum's book on b&w suggesting using citric acid. Haven't tried it yet, but considering how easy it is for me to get, I will give it a try. If a friend did not have some to give me, I would just use a bottle of lemon juice, or check with a homebrewing shop. — - Pssquare
++++++++++++++++
Rapid fixer with citric acid added is a mild silver solvent. The mixture recommended by Kodak for removing dichroic fog from film is film strength rapid fixer with citric acid added at the rate of 15 grams/liter. This may not be strong enough to remove silver from trays and tanks but its worth a try. Probaby rapid fixer stock with the citric increased in proportion would be better. Again, its certainly less hazardous than dichromate cleaner. The only cleaner I am not in favor of is the mild abrasive kind now popular. Eventually these will destroy the shiny surface of plastic trays causing a much worse staining
problem.-- --- Richard Knoppow
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I find that if I wash out the trays with hot water after every developing session (i.e., never leaving it in overnight), I never get silver deposits. -- .~. Jean-David Beyer
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[robert amsden]

Try potasium permanganate.